S&W Polymer Bodyguard 38

A local Sheriff’s Deputy asked me about the new Smith and Wesson .38 “Bodyguard” handguns.

I did a little light inquiry and here is what I have so far.

The few available demo guns were fitted together in time for the SHOT show. As a result there is only a limited number of folks to speak with who have had a chance to handle them and fewer still who have shot them.

The folks I did speak with and who have handled it were impresses.

They did note that with the cylinder release on the “hump” behind the cylinder, the release might (!) get activated if the shooter is in the habit of holding his thumb high on the back strap when planning for a pocket draw.

I though the same thing when I first heard that the release was centered high on the hump. Until that proves out one way or the other let’s give it the benefit of the doubt.

Assuming that the release will not open on pocket draw, this high center-line release location could work out nicely with the Ohio/Taylor revolver reload mechanics I like to advocate.

It was also noted the revolver’s frame is reported to be longer than the classic J-frame so none of the currently produced J-frame stocks will fit. I thought the Ruger missed the boat when the frame shape on their polymer LCR would not take any of the SP 101 stocks or fit into any of the existing SP 101 holsters. I think the same thing regarding S&W’s polymer “Bodyguard.” The only good news is that it might still fit into the ubiquitous J-frame holsters.

S&W's Other (?) Bodyguard

On an aside – And it may only be a pet peeve – but dosen’t S&W already produce a small J-frame sized revolver with the name “Bodyguard?”

Isn’t S&W “enclosed hammer” Quasimodo shaped J-frame called a Centennial? And I thought the Bodyguard had a shrouded hammer and could be thumb cocked.

Also isn’t the model 38 the number for the airweight Bodyguard?

Sooo the “new” S&W Bodyguard 38 is a polymer framed enclosed hammer Centennial but it is not to be confused with the “classic” S&W Bodyguard 38 which is an alloy framed shrouded hammer revolver? 

I don’t have much but if the marketing department drops me a note and tells me they lost theirs I would be willing to send them my thesaurus and a used copy of Roy Jink’s History of Smith and Wesson.

Rather than repeat some good information on the specifications of the “Bodyguard” check out Tactical-Life’s article here.

Any early test-available pre-production guns should be out in the late Spring (S&W date-line) The Massachusetts compliant guns (for non LEO) should be available in the late Fall.

I (currently) have an offer to go to the range and try them out early in the Spring. I will bring a Ruger LCR and a LCP and let them go head-to-head.

Once I have some more info I will get it to you.

Dear Michael:

Here is my question. For years as a right handed shooter I was carrying “strong side”, whether IWB or OWB it was “strong side”.  After an experience at a weekly, local combat shoot, where the range master caught all of us off guard by forcing us to shoot that night’s course weak handed. It set the wheels to turning. I then began to experiment with cross draw carry, and today I almost exclusively carry in a cross draw method. I have crossed up with those who like to tell me the woes of “muzzle sweep” that could be associated with a draw stroke from a cross draw carry position. Personally, as an instructor I preach and practice daily no finger on the trigger until you want to go bang. I have practiced over and over a draw stroke that allows me to grip, pull firearm out of holster (muzzle down) and then rotate the wrist upward thus placing the muzzle directly in front of me. I like the cross draw method for one BIG reason, having the availability to access the firearm with either hand, should that need arise. What are your thoughts and comments please?

Ron

…

Dear Ron:

Thank you for the great question.
 
On the issue of cross draw, we should make a distinction between the cross-draw (reaching across your body) to access the weapon and the cavalry draw (gun and hand on the same side, butt forward and drawing with a twist.)

A lot of very skilled and knowledgeable shooters have relied or currently rely on the cross draw. In the age of the gunfighter there was Wild Bill Hickok. Contemporary, we had one state police department that issued a cross draw holster for years, and I know of bodyguard/drivers who still use it for the reasons you noted i.e. bilateral access.

If your body type permits the weapon’s access it can have its advantages. Some men are too barrel-chested to take advantages of the draw but long armed men and most women find it a viable conceal carry option.

I practice a version of the cavalry draw for my (right hand) injured reaction drills. If the right hand is in injured, I draw with my left hand and transfer the snub’s barrel in and behind the belt line on the left side. This temporary “staging” position puts both the snub’s butt and my left hand’s thumb facing forward. Using the top edge of the belt line to hang on to the short barrel, I can rotate my hand “knuckles against my ribs” and then bring the snub into action.

Bill Bellman out of PA gave me a great “cavalry-draw” trick for when I am drawing the snub left-handed and off the left side of my beltline.
 
1. Grab the stocks with your left hand while keeping the back of your hand and knuckles against your side.
 
2. Draw the snub straight up but only high enough to permit the muzzle to clear the top of the beltline (or the holster if you are carrying left side cross draw.)
 
3. Now, lower the snub until your left hand is straight. Rotate the snub, (top strap and sights forward toward the target) and lift your arm. Align the sights and shoot if appropriate.
 
The great danger with the classic cavalry draw (lifting-and-twisting the snub) that is not present with the Bellman draw (lowering-and-twisting the snub) is that in a rush to bring the muzzle in line with the target it is common to muzzle sweep your own body during the draw.  This is especially true with a short barreled weapon like a snub.
 
Try testing this high cavalry-draw vs. low cavalry-draw with an inert 4-inch revolver and an inert 2-inch revolver and you will see this for your self.
 
You will notice that generally a longer barrel will preventing you from sweeping your upper chest nearest to your high ribs. The short barrel won’t give you the save level of safety. You should also notice that you can use the Bellman draw safely with any length barrel.

If you are practicing some version of the Sykes/Fairbairn/Applegate “point shooting” – even just for fun – this draw strokes will put you in perfect “water-pump” arm lift position.
 
To help make some of the above clearer I will try and get some photos added in within a few days.

To conclude, while the cross draw (strong hand) and cavalry draw (weak hand) draw stroke isn’t for everyone it does offer up a few distinct advantages. Especially in permitting weapon access by either hand.

On the down side, it does also put the butt forward toward the potential attacker and this will require that you put a premium on your; concealment garment, a top quality retention style holster and, the need for adding some weapon retention skills to your own martial arts bag of tricks.
 
Again, thank you again for the great question and I hope this information is of some value.
 
Yours,
 
Michael de Bethencourt

Michael:

Currently I have a couple of S&W model  60’s, older vintage, one with a bobbed hammer and a Ruger SP 101, 2 1/4” barrel.  I have been watching for an air weight S&W without the internal lock.  [Revently] I ran across a S&W model 37  in very good shape.

I don’t feel that I can justify buying another snub yet I am not sure what might [be the wiser trade for] the model 37.  I find that I most often prefer the model 60’s over the Ruger. [Your thoughts re:] dispose of the Ruger and go strictly with the model 60/37 J-frames? I know I would give up the option of .357 capability, but I normally only carry + P in the Ruger.  

Mr. R.

Dear Mr. R:
 
I hope this note finds you well.
 
Thank you for the great question.
 
Here is my thoughts … of course you’re getting what you’re paying for. 

 
Option 1 – If I had two (?) model 60’s (offering me +P power for the cooler weather concealed behind slightly heavier cover clothing) and one SP101 (offering me .357 power for the cold weather/heavier cover clothing) and then along came the chance for an airweight model 37 (offering me .38 power for the warm weather/light cover clothing) I would A) Trade-off or B) Sell-off one of the 60’s – IF(!) I could get a good price – either through the dealer or in a private sale.
 
When ever you sell-off a gun you risk “seller’s regret” but in this case you would be trading one heavy J-frame for a light weight J-frame (so its more of a metamorphosis than a loss) while you still posses a heavy J-frame and a heavy (!) duty .357.
 
Option 2 – If I had one model 60’s (offering me +P power for the cooler weather with slightly heavier cover clothing) and one SP101 (offering me .357 power for the cold weather/heavier cover clothing … which gets loaded and shot with .357 ammo rarely, is expensive to shoot and is a BEAR to master) and then along came the chance for an airweight model 37 (offering me .38 power for the warm weather/light cover clothing) I would A) Trade-off or B) Sell-off the Ruger SP101 - IF(!) I could get a good price – either through the dealer or in a private sale.
 
Why sell off the SP101 and not the one (1) model 60? – Because the 60/37 team will let you mix and match; holsters, stocks, Laser (?) stocks, (some) ammo and give a lot of season concealment versatility. In fact 75% of the time you would lose nothing (Spring/Summer/Fall.) You are only “down powering” 25% of the time – and only if you were “up loading” for the Winter with .357.
 
Also, while I LOVE the SP101 your 60/37 set operates in the exactly the same faction, specifically the cylinder release – so there is 0% chance of fumbling the release – Something you can’t guarantee with a J-frame/Ruger match up.
 
Also (again) while I LOVE the SP101 I never got over the two-piece ejector rod design. I have always thought that that “feature” was the SP101’s “Achilles heel.”
 
Chew on it for a while and let me know what you go with.
 
I would love to get your feed back and thoughts too.
 
I hope that helped.
 
Thank you again for a  great question.
 
Yours,
 
Michael de Bethencourt
SnubTraining@hotmail.com
www.SnubTraining.com

Shane wrote:

My main question is, with the rise of multiple attackers being the norm, is the snubby still a viable tool for these ever increasing challenges?

Dear Shane:
 
I hope this note finds you well.

Thank you for the great question.

If I may restate and paraphrase it, you’re asking: “Do I believe that the snubby possess a sufficient round count to be practical against multiple attackers?”

I would say the answer is (in order): No, Maybe and Yes.

Answer 1: No – I don’t know if the snub is or isn’t enough gun for some/most/all multiple attacker assaults because I don’t know the; Who, What, When, Where, How, How many, How willing, What tactics, etc. of the all the parties involved. But if I have to assume the worst case scenario – An unskilled neophyte vs. a skilled, motivated gang then I would have to say “No.”

Answer 2: Maybe – If I know something of the defender and something about the bad guy(s) I might be able to say “Maybe.”

Since everyone loves *antidotal* stories let me give you two to support (not prove) the point:

Officer X is moving his prisoner out of the housing area to the PD car. He is armed with one six-shot revolver. Friends of the bad guy show up and surround Officer X. Seventeen by some estimates. The “leader” of this ad hock gang steps in Officer X’s way and informs him that a) He (Officer X) “Ain’t taking the guy anywhere.” and b) They have more guys than he has rounds in his gun.

What would you do?  You have zero seconds. Times up. Well Officer X draws his gun, points it in the bigmouth and tells him “Yea, and the first five are for you.” Now what you need to know about Officer X is he is a shooter. A man 100% committed to shooting bad guy(s) the instant he know there isn’t another option. There is absolutely no “maybe” in anything Officer X says or does. Two seconds after the gun came out Officer X just walked his prisoner on by. Now what won the fight, the round count or the man? Now let me ask you a trick question, lets say all 17 pulled guns on Officer X. What would he have done? What would you have done?  You have zero seconds. Times up. Officer X would have shot that one guy in the face. Five times. Just like he said he would. Officer X’s secret (I believe) is that he knows that you DON’T fight 3 or 5 or 15 or what ever number of guys. You can’t. You fight ONE guy, one at a time. You may end up in 3 or 5 or X number of fights in a very short time period but you do NOT fight multiple guys a once. 
 
Second event – Officer Z is in the car doing paperwork. He has a six-shot revolver in his waist band and a vest under his uniform. Four gang bangers come up on each corner of the car. By available accounts there was one pistol per bad guy. The first bad guy to get to the car sticks his gun in the open window and starts pulling the trigger. As the bad guy’s hand is coming into the window Officer Z sees what’s coming and shoves his gun out the window, forearm passing forearm and starts pulling his trigger. So how do you think this is going to finish up – One guy with six-rounds vs. four guys with six to sixty (?) rounds? You have zero seconds. Times up. Let’s pause to ask you a question. BEFORE Officer Z started pulling the trigger how many bad guys was he facing? Four? One? You tell me. 1/100 of a second after he started pulling the trigger, how many bad guys was he facing? I’ll tell you. ZERO. They came in for an ambush. They screwed off at Mach-3 when it became a gunfight, and they didn’t sign up for no gunfight. So …

Since I know something about both Officers X and Z (I worked with both of them years ago) I can say that for them a low round count weapon can be a viable weapon against multiple attackers … sometimes.

Answer 3: But if you are asked me (Michael de Bethencourt) if I think the snub is enough gun for multiple attackers (define “multiple”) coming against me (Alone, with neither friends nor family in tow) I would say (drum roll please ….) “It’s a nonsense question. Right up there with “Do you still beat your wife?”

Here’ are my thoughts, valid only for me but I’ll share them anyway.
  
1 – No one can win a gunfight against multiple shooters so I pre-reject the concept of facing multiple shooters. Faced with multiple attackers, I plan to pick the one guy that I am reasonable certain I can stop (We don’t kill – we shoot to stop, right? … rrrright) and I make it VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE FOR HIM to try and kill me. If the gun goes dry I use my knife. If the knife breaks off I use my teeth. I have only one rule – Start one job and see it through – The universe will have to offer someone else the leftovers. Multi tasking doesn’t work in business or in gunfighting.
 
2 – Cull the herd, divide and conquer, call it what you will. In a real fight … most of the time … groups are only tough because they are anonymous. If you survive the gunfight with the one (1) guy God himself assigned to you then look around. IF there are still bag guys and IF they are still trying to kill you and IF you’re are still alive go back for “seconds.” But that is a lot of “IF’s.”

3 – Any gun you actually have-when-you-need it (even the lowly, low round count 2-inch snub) beats the entire collection of high round count guns you don’t have when you need them. So … since I carry a 2-inch snub year round, and IF I could not take Andy Stanford/Ed Lovettes’ advice to Evade, Avoid or Escape, and am forced into the fight with it (my snub) it would have to be a “viable” gun because it is the gun I will be using.

My advice on self-defense handguns comes down to this: Pick out that “minimum” gun you are absolutely certain you will be carrying when it is absolutely impractical and uncomfortable to carry any other make/model/style gun. Train with it like you will be facing three attackers. Learn to draw quickly, hit what you are aiming at quickly, learn to shoot on the move and learn to reload quickly with the spare ammo and the ammo carrier you actually carry. Train hard – its fun to do so it anyway. Then if you have to face one guy followed by one guy followed by one guy all one-after-the-other then you might just pull it off.
 
Anyway, that’s my plan.
 
Of course … I could be wrong.
 
Thank you again for the great question.

Fell free to share this with friends if you think they would be interested.
 
I hope that helped a little.
 
Yours,
 
Michael de Bethencourt
SnubTraining@hotmail.com
www.SnubTraining.com

Michael:

I have a couple of questions about your suggested “first revolver” EDC:

1. Why a Hip-grip instead of a holster for your primary gun?

2. Why do you recommend wearing the heavier gun on the ankle instead of on the belt? [Side question: Do you have problems with the ankle holster sliding down your ankle and becoming more visible?]

3. Why do you recommend having only one gun with Crimson Trace Laser Stocks?

4. Why put the CT Laser Stocks on the backup gun?

Yours,

John K

…

Dear John:

Great questions, here are a few thoughts:

1. Because as much as a RAGE about the importance of a proper low profile, concealable belt line holster (See BobMacs.com – This guy will be huge in the snub holster market) X-number of folks keep shoving their snub in their pockets (Look for another of my rants against pocket holster in the blog in a few days)

If I can’t keep them away from pocket holsters and if I can’t make them buy a comfortable and slim hip-holsters but they will slip the snub into a waist band if it is convenient then the Clipdraw, the Barami Hip-Grip and the expensive (!) but nice Collin’s Lip Grip is a functional compromise for real people.

2(a) Because a light gun on the belt won’t pull down the pants (Even a great belt/holster will pull down farther than a light gun in the same holster. At the same time, a heavy gun in the well made (Alessi, etc) ankle won’t slip down – or if it did, by how much – a 1/4 of an inch? – Also, here is a “cheap” fighting trick – I don’t want to train myself to go from my “main” gun to the BUG but from the BUG to my main gun. The light .38 snub on my belt “starts” the fight but if the fight continues past 5 or 6 rounds them I’m going for my main, heavy .357 snub on the ankle. If I’m still in the fight after the first 5 or 6 rounds I want to be moving UP in gun, not down to a BUG – If that makes sense.

2(b) Never with a well made ankle holster. Be sure to buy your pants long from the Big-and-Large shop and have the tailor hem the cuffs around the gun/ankle holster. 99% of all tailors have fitted clothing around guns (ask first) so they won’t get startled. The extra long pant leg(s) will give you a wider cuff width and when it is hemmed the gun will be covered even when you are sitting. Also consider an old state trooper trick for ankle guns. Have the fellow cut the seam up about 6 to 8 inches and sew in Velcro to close the seam. If you ever need the gun then the Velcro can aid in the draw/access.

3 and 4 – Money. No, kidding, the belt-line gun is *usually* a fast reaction draw weapon when the bad guy has attacked from ambush. By the time the ankle gun comes out either he, you, or both are behind cover. That is the time I may need a little laser stock help with distance accuracy and intimidation.

I hope that helps.

Yours,

Michael

CTC 205 Laser Stocks

Dear Michael:

I have a question regarding CT laser grips: Why were the model 205s discontinued? I really like these grips and have just made the decision to invest in them and I have recently come to find out that they are no longer made. I understand that I can still find them on the internet, but I am wondering if there was\ is some problem with them. Alternately, my second choice would be the 105’s, just would like some advice on this. Thanks for your time.

Your,

Dustin

CTC 105 laser stocks

Dear Dustin:

Thank you for the great e-mail.

I don’t know why they dropped the 205. It was the best of the laser stocks. I have been given several reasons over the years but the reason(s) vary with the source.

The 105 is an option, but in terms of features it runs a very distant second to the 205.

The 105’s sole advantage is that you can buy it new with a warranty.

If I had to go with the 105 I would reduce the circumference of the stocks closest to the butt (it is currently built with a “bird-head’s style – yuck!) I would also re-cut the stocks to take speedloaders.

For the cost and time involver you would think these features would already be present.

Also, chances are if one fixes the stock one would void the warranty – so we end back at the 205.

On an aside, I will do a blog photo piece on how to fix the 105’s problems so keep your eye on the blog.

Thank you again for the great question.

I hope this information was of some value.

Yours,

Michael

Hi Michael,

Q 1 – I have been studying your strong hand reloading technique (I am right handed), which I believe is a major contribution to swift and effective reloading. However, I have a question. When bringing the pistol up to perform the ejection, how do you avoid having hot spent shell casings fall into your shirt cuff? I guess if you are wearing the right shirt it wouldn’t matter, but I often roll up my sleeves. Do you raise the right arm up higher and arch it toward your body so they fall free?

Q 2 – Also, I have a Smith and Wesson 640 (all steel), and I am really enjoying training with it. You mentioned the Barami grip on your website. If I were to use that set up, where do you recommend carry? At the 2:00 area, or behind the hip?

Q 3 – Finally, I am considering having some Bowen sights installed on the above pistol. However, I am wondering whether it is necessary to have it done. It seems you’re your technique doesn’t require precision sighting. The Bowen sights are very appealing (perhaps because it is what I am used to on my 1911), and I think it would be a nice enhancement on my pistol. I noticed you linked to Bowen on your website. Do you recommend this installation?

Thanks for all the info you have developed and published on your website. I am really getting a great deal from studying it. I hope someday to be able to take a class with you.

John

Dear John:

Thank you for your questions. Here are my thoughts:

A 1 – The rate at which the .38’s cool has always been so quick that I never noticed the residual heat off the ejected rounds. It is a great question though so I will have to test some hot .357 and see how the rate of cooling fits in with the current technique.

A 2 – As much as I like the Barami I usually only use them on an Air Weight snub and not with an all steel guns. I find that to keep my pants up I have to pull the belt too tight to offer a fast draw. When I carry an all steel gun it is usually as a 2nd gun to my Air Weight 1st gun and the all steel gun is (with me) in an Alessi ankle holster. With that said, with the Barami on an Air Weights I generally carry in just to the right of my belt buckle. For the draw stoke I like to practice coming straight down on the stocks from above, then pulling the snub across (to the right) and up toward my right-side floating rib.

A 3 – Ouch! That is a tough question. Generally I like anything that improves sight acquisition. Bowen is expensive but for some snubs that don’t shoot point-of-aim, point-of-impact it is an option. It is also an option for shooters with poorer (near sight) vision. Regarding my own aiming methods I try and practice five sighted fire methods: NRA classic or traditional, Cooper/Stanford Flash sight, Ayoob StressFire, Cirillo Silhouette and an eclectic laser stock method. Point of fact, while I like the Bowen I am a little more partial to the XS sights with the “U” rear sight option whenever they are available.

I hope that helps – Yours, Michael

Hi Michael,

I have limited experience with a revolver. My shooting skills are probably intermediate at this point, but beginner for a revolver. I have a few questions if you don’t mind.

• What snub revolver do you recommend?
• Any downside to “hammerless” revolvers?
• I am left handed, do I have other issues to consider?
• Does S & W shooting range let people test revolvers before I purchase?

My intention is to either carry on my hip or on my ankle for personal protection. I am leaning towards a Smith but would love your input on which model.

Thanks for your time and I hope that you have a great holiday.

Best regards,
Jim

m38 Air Weight J-frame

Dear Jim:

Thank you for for the great questions. Here are my thoughts:

What snub revolver do I recommend?

Snub options will depend a lot on the shooter’s hand size but generally I like any J-frame (5-shot) S&W in Air Weight (but not the AirLite guns.) The blue steel guns are also good if you can work around the extra weight. I also like the alloy frame 6-shot Colts and while the alloy 6-shot S&W are great guns their K-frame size is – for some shooters – not optimum for a deep concealment.

Is there any downside to “hammerless” revolvers?

I know all the famous gun writers/trainers rave about the hammerless (Centennial) guns – but I advocate for the shrouded (Bodyguard) styles – or failing that an Air Weight Chief Special with an after market shroud (Full disclosure – I am helping Waller and Son dispose of the last of the J-frame hammer shrouds)

The reason I like a shrouded snub is that there are a few “ready it fire” checks you can do both safely and quickly with a shrouded snub you can’t do with the hammerless snubs

I am left handed, do I have other issues to consider?

The snub is a non-symmetric weapon like a semi-auto pistol but there are no problem shooting the snub left handed in our classes. Currently I have two loading videos for the snub on YouTube – one is for the left handed shooter. It is not as slick as the LFI StressFire method but I think it is more reliable. Either way we cover and advocate skill with both methods. Try “Googling” snub reloading left handed – both methods should come up.

Does S & W shooting range let people test revolvers before I purchase?

The Smith and Wesson Shooting Sport Center does rent snub for use on their public shooting range. You can contact them for current rental rates at 800-331-0852

Advice (?) -

If I were new to the snub this is where I would start: I would find a S&W Bodyguard model 38 (Air weight) – render it double action only (do not “bob” the hammer) and chamfer the cylinders. If it was my only gun I would add a Barami Hip-Grip and a Tyler T-grip adaptor – Such a basic set-up would cover 99% of all your shooting needs.

If I wanted a second gun for back-up or an “understudy” gun for heavy training I would get another snub – a blue steel version of the same gun, the Bodyguard model 49 and render it double action only and chamfer the cylinders.

I would also pick up an Alessi ankle holster and (if I were saving money I would buy another Barami/Tyler grip set-up. If I had some extra money I would order a set of Spegel Boot Grips. If I wanted the best early and had the money I would get a set of Crimson Trace 205 laser stocks. If I could not afford laser stocks right away I would save up for a set.

The only extra I would allow myself is replacing the current “art-deco” style cylinder releases with a classic style set of releases. The old style releases offer several advantages over the new style.

If I had two snub set up in the above fashion I would consider myself “set” for life. The contact info for all that gear is on the “links” page on the SnubTraining web page. For what its worth.

If I missed anything or if the answers lead you to think of new questions please feel free to e-mail me. I hope this helped.

Thank you again for the great questions.

Yours,

Michael de Bethencourt
www.SnubTraining.com

Spegel Boot Grip stocks

I need to get a set of grips for the other Cobra and was wondering if Spegel’s would do the job. The newer Cobra has the long handle. I was wondering if that would be a problem.

Yours,

Albert

Dear Albert:

Thank you for the question.

First the good-news – Spegel make the only stocks I put on my self-defense guns.

They are well made, comparable in price to any on the market, are the ONLY set of stocks properly relieved for all models and shapes of speedloaders, and there is enough material in them for a good grip without adding material that would compromise concealment.

Craig Spegel generally make up his Boot Grips for S&W J-, K- and N-frame guns but he currently has the tooling up-and-running for Colt Cobras, Agents and Detective Specials.

Unfortunately your second Colt has a “long” frame and the Spegel Boot Grips are cut only to fit the “short” frame Colts.

There are a few options.

On the high end you can ask your gunsmith what he would charge to “bob” the frame to match the short frame’s dimensions. Unfortunately, when you add up the cost of gunsmithing and the cost of the stocks the total could become prohibitive.

Alternatively, you could go with another stock maker.

Eagle Grips Secret service stocks (for J-frames)

If I have to go that route I would choose a set of Eagle Grip’s Secret service stocks (no connection to the US Secret Service) They do not have the same fit or finish of the Spegel stocks, and they are not relieved for speedloaders to the degree the Spegel stocks are but they are the best second option currently available.

I hope the information is of some help.

Thank you again for the great question.

Yours,

Michael de Bethencourt